- Month 0 (Jan 1933): Hitler appointed Chancellor
- Month 1 (Feb 1933): Reichstag fire; Reichstag Fire Decree suspends key civil liberties
- Month 2 (Mar 1933): Reichstag elections; Enabling Act passed; Dachau concentration camp opened
- Month 3 (Apr 1933): nationwide boycott of Jewish businesses; Civil Service Law purges Jews and political opponents from state jobs
- Month 4 (May 1933): independent trade unions seized and dissolved; replaced by the German Labour Front (DAF)
- Month 5 (Jun 1933): Social Democratic Party banned nationally
- Month 6 (Jul 1933): Law Against the Formation of New Parties makes Germany a one-party state
- Month 8 (Sep 1933): Reich Chamber of Culture law brings arts and press under Propaganda Ministry control
- Month 9 (Oct 1933): Editors’ Law (Schriftleitergesetz) excludes Jews from journalism and subjects editors to regime oversight
- Month 10 (Nov 1933): one-list Reichstag “election” and referendum held with opposition already illegal
- Month 12 (Jan 1934): Law on the Reconstruction of the Reich abolishes state parliaments and centralizes power
- Months 17–18 (Jun–Jul 1934): Night of the Long Knives purge eliminates SA leadership and other rivals
- Month 19 (Aug 1934): law merging President and Chancellor signed; Hindenburg dies; army swears personal oath to Hitler, Hitler becomes Führer
- Month 32 (Sep 1935): Nuremberg Laws strip Jews of citizenship and outlaw marriages/relations with “Aryans”
Second, look how Trump is pressuring the networks to get rid of other media personalities who are unfavorable to him:
> “Congratulations to ABC for finally having the courage to do what had to be done,” Trump wrote in a post on his Truth Social platform. “That leaves Jimmy (Fallon) and Seth, two total losers, on Fake News NBC. Their ratings are also horrible. Do it NBC!!!”
We have a serious problem.
Of course not.
The walls of our echo chamber are made out of titanium.
https://globalnews.ca/wp-content/uploads/2025/07/trump-the-l...
> This is what happens, when Marxists don’t get their way. [0]
This is objectively much worse than what Kimmel said. Yet, no repercussions.
When Charlie Kirk, an influential figure, is assassinated:
> I have introduced a resolution condemning the assassination of Charlie Kirk, commemorating his outstanding patriotism and achievements.
> I look forward to the Senate uniting to honor Charlie, his family, and his courageous legacy. [1]
Both incidents are obviously horrific, and should be condemned, but our elected officials ought to be held to a better standard than a late night talk host, and we as a society should hold our elected officials accountable to such behavior.
[0] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/sep/11/republican-s...
What happened to freedom of speech?
Why else would the administration be so afraid of a few jokes?
> ABC said it was pulling the “Jimmy Kimmel Live!” show off the air “indefinitely” after controversial comments by its host about the slain conservative activist Charlie Kirk.
but the article says the following, which is entirely different:
> “The MAGA Gang desperately trying to characterize this kid who murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them and doing everything they can to score political points from it,” Kimmel said.
>
> “In between the finger-pointing, there was grieving,” he added.
I'm hoping that this is just the high watermark, and not the new standard.
[1] - https://www.fcc.gov/sites/default/files/broadcasting_false_i...
I already thought it was very suspicious that Sinclair's official press release just talks about how the remarks were "inappropriate and deeply insensitive" without describing anything about the actual remarks. And it even calls for the FCC to get involved?
What this really says is: you should be very afraid, because we will completely demolish if it suits us and we don't need a pretext.
How many companies, media people and politicians need to bend the knee before someone stands up and says this has all gone far enough?
Sensitive much? Not really the emotional intelligence and maturity one wants from an establishment running a country of 300 million people and all the problems that encapsulates.
The US is in all kinds of trouble and, unfortunately, the rest of the world is going to get some of it on them.
But I do think, after decades of reflection, that comedians are correct when they point out that stereotypical humor shouldn't be off limits to any performer (of any background/color), but is... e.g. Owen Benjamin, Chappelle, Seinfeld.
As much as I can tell, they're mad because Kimmel pointed out a couple of instances where Trump seemed to care more about his new ballroom at the WH than about the recent murder of Kirk.
I've been reluctant to toss around the f-word, but it doesn't feel like an exaggeration to call this fascism. Kimmel said nothing that should have warranted a suspension.
Regardless of what Kimmel said and if you think it was appropriate or not, we are seeing this administration use this as an opportunity to trample on the free speech rights of everyone they disagree with. If everyone's rights are not protected, then nobody's are.
https://variety.com/2025/tv/news/trump-absolutely-love-steph...
Make no mistake, this is a witch hunt. Very soon there will be no one left who publicly speaks out against Trump.
That paired with comments criticizing the Dear Leader were enough. This is a new low in corporate cowardice toward Trump bullying.
Terrible precedent aside, how could Disney think that capitulating here will result in anything other than more attempts to control their programming in the short term?
Realistically, how could anyone be okay with the level of power this administration is wielding? I struggle to see a peaceful transfer of this specific set of powers. Unless the assumption is just that the left will always behave "more responsibly."
This is a 1st amendment issue.
I feel like this is the sort of thing a prediction market might be able sort out.
And yet, my mother, who voted for this admin, would stand by the statement that we live in the free'est country in the world.
The truly horrific thing is that it's death by a thousand cuts, rather than the huge tyrannical violation that would cause people to stream out into the streets for change.
We've sure come a long way from The Man Show.
News just today--
Republican DoJ censored longitudinal study previously published by DoJ which revealed that far and away the most U.S. political violence is perpetrated by... Republicans! Both internally and internationally.
Utah Republicans put a suicide watch on Kirk-shooting suspect because they want the pleasure of killing him themselves.
Noem is bragging that she shot the family hunting dog because he was "worthless"; all he would do is "massacre chickens" at her hunting lodge, and tried to bite her. She also put down a "disgusting, musky billy goat" that lived around her compound. She said wanted to come clean and show how she can "responsibility". She bragged that the story of shooting her dog got her the top slot at ICE.
Republicans:
- Bullying - Bigotry - Censorship - Election interference - Gerrymandering - Blackballing - Targeting for death - Persecuting - Trafficking - Inciting & agitating - Grifting
The beat goes on.
As W used to say "You're either with us..."
bummer.
“I'm sorry, ladies and gentlemen, there's no reason to do this song here.”
Tom Lehrer - https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/7275489-i-don-t-think-this-...
The pretext is really falling away.
There's no discussion, no indication what really happened, facts are irrelevant, all lies and threats:
https://www.independent.co.uk/tv/news/trump-free-speech-abc-...
lese majesty /s
Which is IMO a bad decision. You can ignore politics, but politics won't ignore you.
Do I even need the sarcasm mark?
This is not where the revolution would be. Ever.
could you list the assassinations that you are not neutral on? I feel the list could be interesting if not prolly infamous
This seems confusing to me. The default "neutral" position on any murder, most of all when you don't know much about the victim, is that murder is a horrible thing, is it not? Is that what you mean, or do you mean you aren't sure if this was good or bad?
Any human with their head screwed on straight innately assigns a very negative value weight to murder. To get yourself into a situation where you aren't sure about a murder would require you to have pretty strong beliefs about the victim or circumstance, which you claim to not have.
You're quoting a Chappelle joke that he made literally from a fucking netflix special. He's definitely been "cancelled" making millions off of trans jokes. Amazing evidence that comedy is illegal now. I honestly don't know how anyone could take this drivel seriously unless they literally only consume media from a very narrow selection of highly biased resources.
Kimmel
We hit some new lows over the week end with the MAGA gang desperately trying to characterize this kid who murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them and doing everything they can to score political points from it. In between the finger pointer, there was uh grieving. On Friday the White House flew the flags at half staff which got some criticism but on a human level you can... see how hard the president is taking this.
Reporter
My condolences on the loss of your friend Charlie Kirk. May I ask, sir, personally, how are you holding up over the last day and a half, sir?
Trump
I think very good, and by the way right there you see all the trucks. They've just started construction of the new ball room for the White House, which is something they've been trying to get, as you know, for a 150 years, and it's going to be a beauty.
Kimmel
Yes. He's at the fourth stage of grief. Construction.
Demolition. Construction. This is not how an adult grieves the murder of somebody called their friend. This is how a four year old mourns a gold fish, ok? And it didn't just happen once.
https://people.com/donald-trump-misses-charlie-kirk-vigil-11...
What, in the clip, could reasonably be referred to as "the sickest conduct possible?" No one with a healthy, functioning mind could possibly use that language to talk about Kimmel's comments in that clip.
The government has no such right. Congress shall make no law abridging the freedom of speech.
I've heard this before, but where did this originate? Did Jimmy just make it up or was he quoting some source? I heard the same thing but from people I interact with that this guy was crazy right wing nazi and killed Kirk because Kirk wasn't hard-line enough. But then the bullets said "Catch, fascist" which is kind of odd. Like, are fascists calling each other "fascists" as a meme, or was the killer signing his name like "catch, <signed by> fascist".
This isn't a drill. It's also not a real fire. Half truths are a grifter's greenbacks.
So: As much as I admire Mel Brooks, this is just wishful thinking.
But maybe we get new generations of comedians that will.
What Gavin Newsom is doing is, I think, a bit more subtle. He's signaling to Democratic supporters "Here's a guy willing to mock and ridicule Trump," because the established Democrats were too afraid to even do that - which explains why in this age of Trump, Democrats' poll numbers are still in the gutter.
[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45282482#45283234
Thank you for helping me think about / express this better.
https://help.pbs.org/support/solutions/articles/5000692392-w...
I’ve been hearing a variation of this for at least 9 months. Can’t help but see Americans as frogs in the boiling water. Surely it can’t get hotter than this, can it?
https://progressive.org/op-eds/weve-always-known-fox-news-is...
I guess Fox is next then. After all, the FCC is definitely not going to be found anything less than even handed.
> The FCC prohibits broadcasting false information about a crime or a catastrophe if the broadcaster knows the information is false and will cause substantial “public harm” if aired.
> FCC rules specifically say that the “public harm must begin immediately, and cause direct and actual damage to property or to the health or safety of the general public, or diversion of law enforcement or other public health and safety authorities from their duties.”
> Broadcasters may air disclaimers that clearly characterize programming as fiction to avoid violating FCC rules about public harm.
It’s very obvious that Kimmel didn’t cause, and couldn’t have caused, any public harm.
How can it not be an overreach ?
How long until Fallon and Myers after the president all but threatened them? Guess we’ll find out how high this water will go.
Let's perhaps say that if satire doesn't directly prevent authoritarianism, it works as a very effective canary in the mine.
Joe Rogan, the Fear Factor host turned Right Wing podcaster? Is he know for comedy? I thought his brief failed stint of stand up comedy is why he switched to podcasting.
CNN doesn't show a clip, but explains what was said & the events that caused this.
https://www.cnn.com/2025/09/17/business/video/abc-jimmy-kimm...
Never believe those who claim to be in favor of free speech, but then use threats of legal intervention against those who practice it.
Off topic, but has there been convincing evidence that the suspect is right wing/MAGA, as Kimmel implied? I've seen some posts on reddit to this effect, but they're far from convincing.
https://www.cnn.com/2025/09/16/us/text-message-tyler-robinso...
Lots of people say things like "I know I should read, but it's this whole thing..." and then you find out they've been stuck on page 3 of Wuthering Heights for forty years, because someone convinced them they ought to be reading that, and it's haunted them from their night-stand ever since.
Don't let anyone tell you what to read, pick up something that sounds fun to you, and read it. Choosing to read something is always and in every circumstance better than sitting in front of a screen and passively yielding to whatever evening the advertisers have planned out for you.
You can't make this stuff up.
[1] https://www.foxnews.com/media/fcc-chair-brendan-carr-defends...
Regulating “false information?”
There was no false information and the substance of the clip is just video of a person responding to a question.
Napoleon shut down all the newspapers that criticized him. He was only undone by Waterloo (actually mostly by his own folly of trying to invade Russia ...)
I don't think there's any record of Authoritarianism being defeated by satire, if for no other reason than the authoritarians shut the satire down.
Looks like it's time for an American _Solidarność_
Looks like Lèse-majesté is making a comeback
Probably true, which means you're in for a full-blown dictatorship for, oh, 30 years or so before (perhaps) some violent revolution.
As with all authoritarian regimes, their assumption is that this is the end of history and those in power today will be in power forever. You're also right that they believe liberals will never do what they're doing now.
But the old guard is dying. Trump, Bush, Biden, Clinton, Obama are all boomers+ who will be dead sooner rather than later. The younger generation realizes the pendulum is about to swing, power will be ours to take, and you can be damn sure we will not behave like our parents and grandparents did.
So me personally, when I see them take Kimmel off the air for "not serving the public interest", all I hear is permission for the first progressive millennial president to shut down all of right wing AM talk radio on that same basis. And you know who else sees it that way? Right wing AM talk radio hosts, who have been the only ones on the right asking MAGA to pump the brakes on what they're doing (see: Tucker Carlson).
Oh I'm sure they'll figure it out.
Then I moved to a very red state remote. And none of my co-workers cared until I got a new boss out off Chicago who was excited to have someone on his team that lived in God's country. But for him I wasn't conservative enough (I made a joke about not wanting to use my aerospace degree to make nukes so I switched to software. Guess what he did before software? FML) and I was gone for my wrong think. And I don't think I passed his 'God's country' purity test.
Disney’s ABC is taking Jimmy Kimmel’s late night talk show off the air indefinitely amid a controversy over his recent comments about Charlie Kirk’s suspected killer.
“Jimmy Kimmel Live will be pre-empted indefinitely,” an ABC spokesperson said, declining to share any further details.
A representative for Kimmel did not immediately respond to a request for comment.
The stunning decision came just a few hours after the Trump administration official responsible for licensing ABC’s local stations publicly pressured the company to punish Kimmel.
At least two major owners of ABC-affiliated stations subsequently said they would preempt Kimmel’s show, sparking speculation that the owners were trying to curry favor with the administration. The local media conglomerates are each seeking mergers that would require administration approval.
As Kimmel prepared to tape Wednesday night’s episode in Hollywood, ABC decided to pull the plug, much to the astonishment of the entertainment industry.
Free speech and free expression groups immediately condemned ABC, calling the suspension cowardly, while President Trump, who frequently sparred with Kimmel, celebrated all the way from the UK, where he is on a state visit.
“Congratulations to ABC for finally having the courage to do what had to be done,” Trump wrote in a post on his Truth Social platform. “That leaves Jimmy (Fallon) and Seth, two total losers, on Fake News NBC. Their ratings are also horrible. Do it NBC!!!”
The indefinite hiatus underscores how politicized opinions and comments around the murder of conservative activist Charlie Kirk have become, with high-profile campaigns urging employers to fire people who make comments perceived as unflattering about Kirk.
And the president has also gone after media companies, specifically, when they displease him, as with a $15 billion defamation lawsuit he filed against the New York Times this week and lawsuits against other outlets.
During his Monday evening monologue, Kimmel said the MAGA movement was trying to score political points by trying to prove that Kirk’s alleged killer, Tyler Robinson, was not one of its own.
“The MAGA Gang (is) desperately trying to characterize this kid who murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them and doing everything they can to score political points from it,” Kimmel said. “In between the finger-pointing, there was grieving.”
The ABC late-night host’s remarks constituted “the sickest conduct possible,” FCC chair Brendan Carr told right-wing podcaster Benny Johnson on Wednesday. Carr suggested his FCC could move to revoke ABC affiliate licenses as a way to force Disney to punish Kimmel.
“We can do this the easy way or the hard way,” Carr said. “These companies can find ways to change conduct and take actions on Kimmel, or there’s going to be additional work for the FCC ahead.”
And speaking on Fox Wednesday night, Carr suggested broadcasters would see more of this kind of pressure in the future.
“We at the FCC are going to force the public interest obligation. There are broadcasters out there that don’t like it, they can turn in their license in to the FCC,” Carr said. “But that’s our job. Again, we’re making some progress now.”
But Anna Gomez, the lone Democratic commissioner at the FCC, wrote on X that while “an inexcusable act of political violence by one disturbed individual must never be exploited as justification for broader censorship and control,” the Trump administration “is increasingly using the weight of government power to suppress lawful expression.”
Speaking with CNN’s Erin Burnett after Kimmel’s show was taken off the air, Gomez said “the First Amendment does not allow us, the FCC, to tell broadcasters what they can broadcast.”
“I saw the clip. He did not make any unfounded claims, but he did make a joke, one that others may even find crude, but that is neither illegal nor grounds for companies to capitulate to this administration in ways that violate the First Amendment,” Gomez told CNN. “This sets a dangerous new precedent, and companies must stand firm against any efforts to trade away First Amendment freedom.”
Pro-Trump websites and TV shows began to criticize Kimmel for his remarks on Tuesday, and as the story gained traction on Wednesday, some owners of ABC-affiliated stations felt compelled to speak out.
Nexstar, which operates about two dozen ABC affiliates, issued a press release saying it “strongly objects” to Kimmel’s remarks and saying its stations would “replace the show with other programming in its ABC-affiliated markets.”
Notably, Nexstar is seeking Trump administration approval to acquire another big US station group, Tegna. The deal requires the FCC to loosen the government’s limits on broadcast station ownership.
Minutes after Nexstar criticized Kimmel publicly, ABC said the show was being yanked nationwide.
Later in the evening, another big station group, Sinclair, said it had also told ABC that it was preempting Kimmel’s show on its ABC-affiliated stations before the network announced its nationwide decision.
Sinclair, too, has business pending before the Trump administration, and it made a bid for Tegna a day before Nexstar stepped in with its bid. The company announced Wednesday night that it will air a one-hour special tribute to Kirk on Friday night in Kimmel’s usual time slot.
Following ABC’s action to indefinitely pull Kimmel’s show off the air, Sinclair issued a statement saying the late-night host’s suspension “is not enough” and called on the network, the FCC and Kimmel to go further.
“Sinclair will not lift the suspension of Jimmy Kimmel Live! on our stations until formal discussions are held with ABC regarding the network’s commitment to professionalism and accountability,” the company said in its statement. “Regardless of ABC’s plans for the future of the program, Sinclair intends not to return Jimmy Kimmel Live! to our air until we are confident that appropriate steps have been taken to uphold the standards expected of a national broadcast platform.”
Sinclair said it demanded Kimmel directly apologize to the Kirk family and make a “meaningful” donation to Kirk’s family and his organization, Turning Point USA.
The FCC regulates the public airwaves, including broadcast signals and content. Before Trump appointed Carr to lead the agency, the FCC, for the most part, had taken a hands-off approach to broadcasters’ political content in recent years.
But Carr has taken a broader view of the FCC’s remit to serve the public interest, and has served as a political attack dog for Trump, threatening his perceived enemies in the broadcast media.
“I can’t imagine another time when we’ve had local broadcasters tell a national programmer like Disney that your content no longer meets the needs and the values of our community,” Carr told Fox News’ Sean Hannity on Wednesday. “So this is an important turning point.”
The Center for American Rights, which has previously lodged bias complaints against NBC, ABC and CBS, on Wednesday filed a complaint with the FCC over Kimmel’s comments, writing that “it is no defense to say that Kimmel was engaging in satire or late-night comedy rather than traditional news.”
“ABC’s affiliates need to step up and hold ABC accountable as a network for passing through material that fails to respect the public-interest standard to which they are held,” Daniel Suhr, president of the Center for American Rights, wrote in the complaint. “Disney as ABC’s corporate owner needs to act directly to correct this problem.”
SAG-AFTRA, the actors union, said Wednesday night that it “condemns” the suspension of Kimmel’s show.
“Our society depends on freedom of expression. Suppression of free speech and retaliation for speaking out on significant issues of public concern run counter to the fundamental rights we all rely on,” the union said in its statement.
“The decision to suspend airing Jimmy Kimmel Live! is the type of suppression and retaliation that endangers everyone’s freedoms.”
Kimmel has also been a frequent target of President Trump’s ire. Shortly after CBS announced the cancellation of Stephen Colbert’s late-night talk show — a move Carr publicly celebrated — Trump suggested that “Next up will be an even less talented Jimmy Kimmel.”
Another one is "he was all but dead" which can be understood as "he was really in a bad shape, almost dead", or "he was absolutely not dead, as opposed to what they say"
There are a few more like these (especially in short titles, where I have to analyze word by word the sentence to make sure I got it right)
Granted, it is not reasonable to expect everyone to have been terminally online for this issue, but even before this statement was made, it was clear if you visited places with right-wing bias (e.g. 4chan) that almost no one was concerned this guy might be MAGA. And if you looked at more grey tribe places (e.g. ACX open-thread comments / discussion), it was also already clear the preponderance of evidence and reason in fact definitely point to it being far more likely the guy was left than right (or at minimum some idiosyncratic, but definitely not "groyper" or "MAGA" rightist). Heck, this was even clear if you read through enough Reddit comments sorting by "controversial".
Also, it was abundantly clear the sentiments were: Blue tribe social media desperately looking for evidence against obvious left/progressive connections, Red tribe media gleefully pointing out left/progressive connections, and gray tribe places generally having the usual mix + typical frustration at the over-certainty of everyone else.
I.e., the reality is that the "desperation" was almost entirely on the left (understandably) trying to disown the shooter. What there was on the MAGA right was maniacal glee about all the potential (and prima facie more reasonable) left-wing connections. I doubt noting these overall patterns instead would have saved Kimmel, but choosing to frame the whole thing as "desperate MAGA" was just an insinuation that really ran directly opposite to the facts and reason.
https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2025/9/15/charlie-kirk-ki...
i'm saying: reading is like gambling, it's a lot of fun!
Ironically, I plan on reading Wuthering Heights this October.
If I pick something up and it sucks, I feel bad stopping and force myself to finish it (which will take 8 months because I hate it).
And that stops any reading progress.
Alongside Charlie Kirk."
It was counter to what was reported by federal investigators the day before the show. He was deliberately spreading misinformation.
The reality is that outside of the actual extremists, liberals and conservatives agree on 80% of everything. We can, and need to, start there. We are all Americans and have to realize that just because we may disagree about things (particularly a small percentage of things) doesn't have to mean we're enemies.
But, if history offers any lessons, then our path is likely set and we're going to have to push through some nightmarish times before we find a way to be better.
Government agencies were "recommending" and "cautioning" social media companies on topics such as COVID and laptops. That was not being done to benefit the political rights.
https://www.the-independent.com/news/world/americas/crime/ty...
It seems he was "raised right", with easy access to firearms and ammunition. Items not nearly as common in left voting urban areas.
However, Mr. Kimmel's comments centered on the fact that his political leanings, and reasoning for the school shooting are not entirely clear.
They also have a $6.2 billion bid for even more local stations by acquiring Tegna, a deal which will have to be approved by the guy at the FCC who yesterday was telling local affiliates to threaten to pull Kimmel's show!
https://apnews.com/article/nexstar-tegna-newsnation-cw-trump...
this is so chillingly reminiscent of a serial killers autobiography.
10 years ago I'm fairly certain these moves would have been met with a strong reaction from the public, but now nobody cares...
Everybody "wins"... The right get to gloat, the left get to have talking points and Sinclair get's to freshen up their line up while we all fight it out in the comments.
I'll bet there was a cigar smoke filled back room chat when the discission was made $$$.
Ok, fine, but then "Bella ciao" is an anti-Nazi and anti-fascist Italian folk song (at least according to wikipedia) [1], so, we got a hard right winger, mentioning killing fascists and listening to Bella ciao killing someone like Charlie Kirk. There was "notices bulges" comment which I didn't get. But given just those two clues and having to guess the affiliation of the shooter, not sure how people arrived at "this kid who murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them [maga gang]".
Do you think the CEO would have fired you for being conservative? Or do you think your career wouldn't have advanced because people wouldn't want to associate with someone who's always saying things they find abhorrent?
It's not about Kimmel or the money, it's about the next person not stepping out of line so they don't face the consequences.
> The word is, and it's a strong word at that, Jimmy Kimmel is NEXT to go in the untalented Late Night Sweepstakes and, shortly thereafter, Fallon will be gone. These are people with absolutely NO TALENT, who were paid Millions of Dollars for, in all cases, destroying what used to be GREAT Television. It's really good to see them go, and I hope I played a major part in it!
Nexstar owns outright a bunch of broadcast zones in America, with zero conpetition in those broadcast areas. So them folding and everyone else following suit isn't much of a surprise. It's pathetic that media ownership has degraded to such a sorry lame ass state, that there's many markets where almost all broadcast media is via one company. The decayed anti-health of media continues to plague this nation, allow the worst poxes to spread.
>Mel Brooks had the right of it. Fascism and Authoritarianism is defeated by satire and mockery. The ideology is too outrageous to survive any such scrutiny.
Joe Rogan owns a comedy club in Austin as well. [1]
Joe Rogan is a pretty busy guy.. I would imagine his professional network amongst comedians was pretty large before he blew up as a podcaster. This is not only to say that Joe Rogan has multiple comedies, but is also very likely to be very influential amongst as well.
[1] https://www.comedyinyoureye.com/post/inside-the-comedy-club-...
Government officials also threatened to pull the government provided broadcasting licenses that the corporation has. That’s free speech related.
No. His employer responded to threats from the Republican federal government to prevent them from broadcasting by pulling their FCC license or prevent their merger.
>The sugar industry desperately trying to characterize the obesity crisis as being caused by anything other than one of them and doing everything they can to score political points from it
what would your conclusion be? That sugar isn't a contributing factor to obesity?
Even in your example, I think you misunderstand. "He was all but dead" is never used to mean "he was absolutely not dead, as opposed to what they say". That would be "he was anything but dead".
However, there is a caveat, since even native speakers increasingly over the years speak English "wrongly". Of course, when they do it enough, it's no longer wrong. So maybe you did hear a native speaker use the phrase "he was all but dead" with the latter meaning, but I would put that usage in the "wrong" camp as of 2025.
But that's not what he's saying. He was saying "they were quick to paint him as blue tribe before knowing his tribe." It is just constructed like a sentence that ambiguously also means "desperately constructing that he was not red tribe."
>Red tribe media gleefully pointing out left/progressive connections
Which is synonymous with what JK said. That the reaction was "he was a them, not us, therefore justifying our prejudices."
South Park can go on because they make money. Talk-shows are already dying and cutting them is easy choice even under mild pressure.
The value talk they use is PR aimed at stakeholders (customers, employees, government). No company has taken a stance where they willingly accept net negative returns if they have other choice.
https://latenighter.com/news/jimmy-kimmels-removal-comes-ami...
Anyone living in the USA should by now have made a decision where their line in the sand lies. Without a free press or opposition things can move quickly so decide now. If I was a member of a minority likely to be a target I would want to know I had an exit strategy.
I may disagree with the vast majority of Charlie Kirk's opinions, but he was at a university, inviting others who strongly disagreed with him to debate him, face-to-face. I may not be a particular fan of this style of interaction (I find it to be more about shock value/talking points/getting clips of particular stupid things people will say than actual clarification or education), it was still an open forum that shouldn't be feared in a free society that supposedly values free speech.
Murderers walk freely among you, and we're not all bad people. A few good people earn their legal kills.
A healthy society would encourage any speech which could reduce divisiveness (e.g. comments on Mr. Kirk, without retribution) — yet ours thrives on division, getting people to hate better with bigger hearts.
¢¢
"It is no measure of health to be well-adjusted to a profoundly sick society..."
So why single out this one? I mean who cares about school shootings? One nutjob murdering another nutjob on the other hand…
What a time.
https://www.openculture.com/2020/11/before-creating-the-moom...
But I was refering to was the specific idea of what has been labeled the "Rogansphere" by his critics. This refers to a loose media/comedy ecosystem orbiting Joe Rogan, his podcast, Austin (comedy) clubs, and a web of frequent guests and adjacent podcasters/comedians who cross-promote each other on YouTube and podcasts. This network rose to prominence in a push to normalize "anti-woke" and right-leaning narratives under a free-speech banner. This was a pretty popular niche to serve as the term "cancel culture" gained more traction. At the time even many otherwise (american-)left-leaning people would express frustration with liberal attempts to police language etc.
This popular niche was especially present in comedy with a discourse about what and who you could joke about and since Joe Rogan played a big role into giving that topic traction I cynically called it "Joe Rogan school of comedy". I am no alone in thinking that way, comedian Marc Maron puts it better than I could in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_N4W05eyto&t=307s
Not just corporations, every institution from the church to every silo in your government to big nonprofits. The latter ones just have less measurable goals than profit, but they sociopathically seek their goals all the same. Beyond a certain scale organizations staffed by humans no longer act human.
There was also the theory that it was a black person, hence all the death threats to historically black colleges and universities (HBCUs) https://duckduckgo.com/?q=death+threats+hbcu
So, yes, there was quite a bit of "see, it wasn't one of ours, it was one of yours" after the guy was caught. Especially when the images of the shooter's mother started surfacing indicating he was raised that way. https://duckduckgo.com/?q=tyler+robinson+mother+gun . Charlie Kirk's mother at the memorial service specifically blamed college for radicalizing him, saying that good mother's wouldn't send their kids to college. (I don't have that clip.)
In general, my philosophy is to not speculate publicly when the shooter was going to get caught and identified quickly anyway.
They might think it will save them but acquiescing to a bully never works. It just shows you’re weak and can be pushed around.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-wlfi-world-liberty-financ... ("New crypto token boosts Trump family's wealth by $5 billion")
Old track, but just hard to imagine what would have happened if Biden was asked about his corruption and answered like that. But it's hypothetical anyway, since no previous president would ever be rug-pulling crypto scams or selling watches and bibles.
I just can't believe how weekly, or sometimes daily, I share these wild stories and videos with some friends and they keep behaving like anything about this is normal. There are so many things that would make me go WTF even without the context of the constant grift it all comes with.
Regardless of this specific case the “right” ignores, supports or even encourages political violence on a much bigger scale than anyone else.
So why is it only a problem in some specific cases but not in general?
The “left” on the other hand seems way more heterogeneous in that sense (which does seem like a significant political disadvantage in practical terms).
The exact opposite of what has happened here.
The same will be the situation with laptops.
COVID was completely different because the government was essentially mandating certain measures in order to contain a widespread epidemic (which killed a million people by the way), and so calls to disregard those measures were extremely problematic to public health.
Can't believe you're equating it with what happened here.
Laptops: not sure what that is.
Available here if anyone's curious on an unofficial site https://bingewatch.to/watch-series/watch-south-park-hd-39503...
Maybe (maybe) ten years ago you could get away with this opinion. I'm not sure how you could say this in 2025 in good faith.
https://www.newsweek.com/joe-rogan-mocked-botching-joe-biden...
One of many examples. Joe is outraged because he thinks Joe Biden talked about airports during the revolutionary war. He goes on to state that someone who makes such comments shouldn't have a job. When it's revealed that it's a Trump statement he pivots to "oh he just made a mistake when speaking". It's so blatantly obvious and happens constantly.
ah, sorry I was not clear - what I meant with the "or" is that there are 2 ways to understand this sentence, one of them being incorrect :)
As others have pointed out, this kind of insinuation is very hard to see as anything other than deliberate, given basic media literacy and how modern media operates (https://www.themotte.org/post/3263/culture-war-roundup-for-t...). To save you a click:
> The "desperation" implies a sort of losing battle that they're grasping at straws to prove something that's factually wrong, rather than simply stating truths that are obvious, evident and obviously evident. "Desperate" is a subjective judgment call, of course, so Kimmel absolutely deserves zero government censorship for this, by my lights; all it does is show that his judgment is so bad that it reflects poorly on the judgment of people who hired him as a host for a show like that. That MAGA was trying to characterize the murderer as anything other than MAGA is arguably a bland, neutral fact about reality, but that MAGA was desperately trying to do so is a judgment call that shows extremely poor ability to observe reality or to discern reality.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marburg_speech ("...said to be the last speech made publicly, and on a high level, in Germany against National Socialism...")
An ironic tombstone for freedom of speech:
"They will bear them and follow the Führer with unwavering loyalty, if they are allowed to have their part in the planning and in the work, if every word of criticism is not taken for ill will, and if despairing patriots are not branded as enemies of the state."
> Stop criticizing large corporations as moral entities. They have no other incentives other than money.
I want better for the world.
Demonstrably untrue. Nihilist generalizations make a poster feel cool, but they aren't helpful.
“For 33 hours, I was praying that if this had to happen here that it wouldn't be one of us — that somebody drove from another state, somebody came from another country… Sadly, that prayer was not answered the way I hoped for… But it did happen here, and it was one of us.”
This is why I think the American government is doomed in its current construction. First past the post voting has conditioned people like you to believe that everything is binary. You describe a world with only two parties that can have no dissention in those parties and no possible disagreements among their members. Isn't it obvious how flawed that mindset is?
This country desperately needs more than two options to every issue, but our system is inadvertently designed to ensure that doesn't happen.
That's a question that actually has some easy examples if you'd care to study parties like Sinn Fein or Fatah or the CCCP or... you get the point. American politics has largely been free of this sort of in-fighting (and other kinds of political violence), but a political movement's leaders or followers can be targeted because they're deemed not sufficiently radical or too radical or what have you, or they've fallen out of favor, or they've done something the membership cannot accept, or whatever.
Or, you know: maybe the person doing the "taking out" is just insane.
> They wouldn't, because that's not something that people do to other people they agree with.
Because that's just what a political party always is. A group of calm, rational people who are in total agreement on principles, goals and tactics and are entirely content with their place in the power structure. Ahem.
This fake news was wide spread and even leaked into Hacker News through at least dozens of comments. [3] People are still implicitly trying to promote this misinformation by flagging any comment that mentions it, and spinning Kimmel stating, "with the MAGA gang desperately trying to characterize this kid who murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them" to mean anything other than what it does.
[1] - https://xcancel.com/CollinRugg/status/1966575444435890341
[2] - https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=groyper&...
[3] - https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
Justice Antonin Scalia's opening statement before a 2011 Senate Judiciary Committee hearing is worth watching. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ggz_gd--UO0
Even more worth reading are the Federalist Papers, cover-to-cover, as he suggested. The depth to which the Framers considered the kind of situations we are in today is amazing.
This is not the case for cable licensees, which goes a long way towards explaining why ABC/NBC/CBS/etc have all remained relatively sane in an era where it's clearly become most profitable to pick a side, pander, and confirm their every possible bias. This is because e.g. Fox News or MSNBC can get away with far more than ABC. And this is probably simply an example of something that you cannot get away with on public broadcasts.
Deciding to try to 'joke' about a domestic political assassination, for which countless people are still grieving was dumb. Stating, "We hit some new lows with the MAGA gang desperately trying to characterize this kid who murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them." was very dumb. I think the only issue that makes this debatable for people is the radicalized nature of politics.
If this had been a white wing extremist who murdered a liberal guy who made a living posting public (and atypically respectful) debates, and Kimmel was then mocking it in a similar way, while further implying that killer himself was a Progressive or whatever, then obviously nobody, and I include conservatives there, would see any issues with him being canned.
"Well, we needed to acquiesce to fascism for our stock price" is not acceptable. Over and over and over we are told about how corporations are job creators and serve a valuable function in our society. We are told that having power distributed across corporations that are in competition with one another is a protection against tyranny.
Fat lot of good that did.
More accurate to say "I" as you'll find quite a large number of people blaming ABC for their actions in the coming days.
what? This is nuts. Are you saying you murder people?
> A healthy society would encourage any speech which could reduce divisiveness (e.g. comments on Mr. Kirk, without retribution)
Yes I agree with this. There are a lot of people that do vigils and prayers and eulogies when people die. Then there are people that go: he deserved it and XXX is next. The former does not drive division. The latter does - and that's what needs to stop.
At least they used to. I've lived through the 80s and 90s as a kid, so when someone was murdered - even someone that no one knew - everyone in the country cried.
These days people's minds are so used to it, we're all warped. We were not meant to handle information at that level, so, effectively, we're broken.
It's why there is Tyler Robinson and Luigi and Decarlos. We used to have a country that this kind of thing was so outrageous that it was rare.
And what's even crazier is in the 80s and 90s is that everyone had guns. Even life-long democrats! There wasn't even a movement to get rid of guns. (Well of course there was but it was basically 3 people)
And in any case, a significant majority of political violence is caused by right-wing extremists. Of course the DOJ just deleted that report because it was inconvenient to their narrative.
https://people.com/department-of-justice-quietly-deletes-stu...
Hating Kirk is nothing unusual. Maybe something in his conservative upbringing led him to believe violence was an acceptable action based on his hate.
That's not a belief shared by the Democratic Party.
Kimmel did not assert Mr. Robinson was anything he wasn't. Kimmel noted how some people are doing everything possible to distance themselves from Mr. Robinson.
The discord chats and his relationship with a trans woman were AFAIK not revealed yet, or at least were so new that they maybe hadn't made it to Kimmel's writers room.
That kind of problem gets a demand of a retraction, not a firing.
Contrast that to a Fox News host calling for mass executions of homeless people the other day (and since that day there have been multiple mass killings of homeless people). That guy got off with a thin apology.
All of this stuff should be a slam dunk to implement with broad coalitions no matter who holds which branches, and yet it's all been basically gridlocked for decades, and instead it's never-ending turmoil over meaningless nonsense like who uses what bathrooms.
So there was that example.
Now the FCC threatened ABC/Disney to pull a show because the orange guy dislikes him. I isolation, just this one incident is the death of the concept of America. If we consider the context :thisisfine:
> Appearing on Benny Johnson’s podcast on Wednesday, Carr suggested that the FCC has “remedies we can look at.”
> “We can do this the easy way or the hard way,” Carr said. “These companies can find ways to change conduct and take action, frankly, on Kimmel or there’s going to be additional work for the FCC ahead.”
An absolutely unmistakable direct threat from the chairman of the FCC.
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/26098852-tyler-robin...
To be fair, that doesn't necessarily say anything about his politics. I know plenty of liberals with MAGA parents. I don't think we can draw any conclusions as to his politics at this time.
Most leftists despise their parents politics. None of this suggests a rightward leaning of the culprit himself.
Putting useless or malicious animals down is merciful and common place and definitely not the making of serial killers.
This thread is certainly active with those critical of the administration.
Note, the public at large did not know what Kimmel said until now. The Streisand effect is coming into play, because it was so uncontroversial.
The podcast part, I agree, although it's sad in someways, as it demolishes the national conversation, and makes easier to appeal to "your group" rather than "all groups".
He was raised in a die-hard Trump Christian family. He allegedly had some LGBT friends too, and got angry at Kirk's rhetoric against them as a group. Which, if you knew Kirk before his murder, framing LGBT people as degenerate and dangerous freaks of natures was kind of his bread and butter. This doesn't justify the killing, but certainly explains it.
I'm sure more will come of it, but I doubt there's much of interest in here. What's more important are the reactions of public figures, and so far, none on the right have called for de-escalation.
Moral grandstanding does not work.
If there were a monopoly on media from ONE broadcaster, and that broadcaster didn't fight back, that's a wrap.
But to be sure, competition is NOT an innate feature of capitalism (economic power naturally consolidates in laissez-faire markets), but competition is an external check on capitalism's power; which is empowered by government regulation; and creates mixed market economies. Just as well, mixed market economies - and the ability to have multiple companies for goods and services - are an external check on government AND society power, as well as other companies themselves. It allows people to choose who to work for, buy/sell from, and build their own enterprise if they don't agree with present-day offerings.
The evidence for this appears non-existent: https://www.axios.com/2025/09/15/groyper-charlie-kirk-nick-f...
I swear, people talk about colleges like everybody is forced to watch soviet propaganda in a Clockwork Orange esque restraint.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domestic_terrorism_in_the_Un...
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45207030
Over the last 40 years: 8/16 attacks on that list are linked to White Supremacists(Counting OKC) ~50%
In the last 15 years, again about 50% are linked to White Supremacists and ~41% linked to Radical Islam.
https://www.azfamily.com/2024/12/20/1-4-americans-sympathize...
> It found 28% of people who identified as liberal supported the murder, compared to 5% of conservatives.
Both the left and the right (which tends to be poorer right now) are massively affected by the cost and non-coverage of insurance. The LEFT WING is violent right now.
“just kill ’em”
But the FCC accuses Kimmel of “alienating the audience”.
That's what the other poster is saying. There's a difference between "cancel culture" and what's happening here. Cancel culture is culture, meaning it's something that arises spontaneously through group dynamics, not something that's directed by the government. Yes, Disney fired Gina Carano, but not because Biden tweeted out "Gina Carano is next" and his FCC director said "We can do this the easy way or the hard way". It was because a bunch of Disney's customers pressured Disney.
And that's how the free market / free speech is supposed to work. If that's somehow reprehensible and antisocial, then fine, but then we need to rethink the entire idea of free market capitalism; if the government prevents me and my friends from boycotting some shitty company, then that's not a free market, and what we're doing is crony capitalism, which is just the worst of all worlds.
Can you propose a speech model that supports free speech but disallows cancel culture? As far as I can tell, you'd have to limit free expression and association from the top down to enforce that.
Funny you imagine there is consensus with any of that. The right doesn't want government healthcare. They don't want government sponsored childcare. They could care less about higher education. They want no gun laws. And they don't want black people to benefit from infrastructure.
There is no forming consensus with that position.
Post Nixon the government really just got captured and paralyzed and so a generation has grown up not understanding that this is a deliberately broken government, not how a government can operate. Instead people have been raised to think that all government is just ineffective and naturally broken. The only people who actually get it are the subset of Americans who have traveled or lived overseas for some time. As of 2023 only about half of Americans have a passport so there is a large chunk that haven't seen anything else.
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24780798
>In April 2021, White House advisers met with Twitter content moderators. The moderators believed the meeting had gone well, but noted in a private Slack discussion that they had fielded "one really tough question about why Alex Berenson hasn't been kicked off from the platform."
https://reason.com/2023/01/19/how-the-cdc-became-the-speech-...
Edit: URL was malformed due to copy paste error...
What in his upbringing led him to believe the way to handle the situation was with violence is unclear.
And do you have a source on that? Anecdotally, most "leftists" I know have left leaning parents. But it's up to the person to define if they are or are not "leftist", because it's a rather narrow, small minded world view that has to define things in those terms.
> None of this suggests a rightward leaning of the culprit himself.
Nor does it suggest his leftward leaning. Maybe it suggests why he used violence as a means to enact social change on the world.
edit:spelling
Kimmel did not repeat rumors, he asserted that the political affiliations were unknown.
edit: He asserted the "MAGA gang" trying to distance themselves from Mr. Robinson, which is true. It does not mean Kimmel views Robinson as "MAGA".
what many people call a useless dog, is actually the case of a useless person, with no skills at all regarding husbandry or behavior management.
gloating, feeling powerful as a result of causing death or discomfort, yes those actually are the making of serial killers.
Maybe that's part of the problem? You kill what you consider "useless" or "malicious". Noem killed a puppy.
In a wooded mountain region I frequent (not sure if it's "rural" by colloquial terms, though the USPS classifies it that way), most people try to avoid dangerous wildlife. Killing them is a last resort, and represents a failure to respect nature.
I don't get the "useless" bit. Why would you kill a "useless" animal? Just let it be.
https://www.nexstar.tv/nexstar-media-group-inc-enters-into-d...
I don't care about Jimmey Kimmel's jokes nor do I watch his show with any regularity -- but I sure as hell care about his right to make jokes.
You forgot the rest of the quote:
“In between the finger-pointing, there was grieving.”
That, however, is criticism of the administration.
I am wondering how did Jimmy know what his leanings where? It didn't seem like a guess. The language was pretty definite.
I guess someone found his gun ownership views online. I mean besides using a gun to shoot Kirk, which I don't think anyone needs to hold any ideological leanings to acquire a weapon in US. For instance, if I hear of shootings in Chicago overnight, I am not thinking "it's those 2nd amendment nuts again".
> Typical of a young Utah white guy, I'd say.
I'd agree but only if it wasn't shooting someone like Kirk. If some unknown John Doe was killed somewhere in Utah I can see making a guess that it's probably some maga trumper person doing it. And it would still be a wild guess. Here it seems there was more than a wild guess. And common sense would dictate the guess should have been the opposite -- it's someone opposed to Kirk and maga and all that stuff not for it. And it should been emphasized it's a just a wild guess until it becomes more obvious.
The lend lease part is not correct. Lend lease went mostly to UK (Google AI says about 60% of lend lease went to UK & the rest of lend lease was split between USSR & China. Take that with a grain of salt)
Not to be taken with a grant of salt, according to wikipedia: "Most tank units were Soviet-built models but about 7,000 Lend-Lease tanks (plus more than 5,000 British tanks) were used by the Red Army, eight percent of war-time production. " [1]
Also per wikipedia, USSR produced about 30k light tanks, 65k medium tanks (eg: t-34), and 13k heavy tanks. [2]
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties#/media...
From: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lend-Lease
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_combat_vehicle_producti...
I mean he's not like Tucker say.
>“It’s time for them to step and say this garbage…isn’t something that we think serves the needs of our local communities,” he said.
>Carr’s threat should have been toothless. The FCC is prohibited by law from employing “the power of censorship” or interfering “with the right of free speech.” There is a very narrow and rarely used exception for “news distortion,” in which a broadcast news outlet knowingly airs false reports. What Kimmel did — an offhand comment based on weak evidence — is extremely different from creating a news report with the intent to deceive.
>Hours after Carr’s Wednesday threat, Nexstar — the largest owner of local stations in America — suddenly decided that Kimmel’s comments from two nights ago were unacceptable. Nexstar, it should be noted, is currently attempting to purchase one of its major rivals for $6.2 billion — a merger that would require express FCC approval.
Source: https://www.vox.com/politics/461887/jimmy-kimmel-suspension-...
And I never voice any political opinions at work because I don't want to say anything my peers would perceive as "abhorrent".
Amoral entities can work towards good goals when incentives are right. Empty moral grandstanding does not help.
America has two parties because both parties are very internally open. Democrats have given up on that in the last few primaries but that's still very new, and Republicans are still open. You can enter as an outsider and take over the parties. That's how the Republicans ended up with Trump.
If the two parties were less internally democratic you'd see the same situation in the UK where there are two dominant parties and a bunch of smaller parties that occasionally end up in coalition but mostly act to push the main parties around by threatening to take too many votes.
I was not familiar with the term before either, but afaict it was based on the the shell casing engravings, halloween costumes etc, which I don't believe have been refuted [2]?
Not that this matters to the topic at hand as that isn't a claim Kimmel made either way, nor does it play into how tragic any murder is.
[1] https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/trending-politics/
[2] https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2025/09/17/how-charli...
-----
The decision to preempt ‘Jimmy Kimmel Live!’ was made unilaterally by the senior executive team at Nexstar, and they had no communication with the FCC or any government agency prior to making that decision,” a Nexstar spokesman said.
-----
Immediately following his monologues there advertisers and affiliates contacted and were complaining to Disney. The FCC was, if anything, just the final nail in the coffin.
Also, you can cancel and then re-sub right away with one extra click (and keep any discounted rate). Let them see the numbers and a warning.
A change of status quo in this case, will require massive loss of Disney+ subscriptions, which is not that probable.
Yes; I talked about this here two months ago [0]. In my circumstance, I would do it again with even less hesitation...
[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44476115#44482107
I also have a brother — served four tours as enlisted grunt kicking in combatants' doors — whose tally far exceeds my own (war. is. hell).
It's not that I'm encouraging murder (I'm not); rather, I'm encouraging people to not live in a world where killing is never an acceptible outcome (because it is, sometimes justifiably).
Some actions should literally be paid for with guilty lives ("FAFO"), e.g. child molesters.
But what else can you do? They already control the media and corporations.
Organizations are led by humans.
I want better for the world.
If I was your co-worker, I wouldn't want to know your non-work related opinions, especially your political opinions. That assumes we're not working on someone's political campaign.
Your opinions that don't relate to your job are irrelevant -- at work. And as such, why would anyone, whether they agree with you or not, want to hear you (or anyone else) pontificate about how you "Like Ike" and that his Vice President would make a much better President than that (gasp!) Catholic, rum-runner/gangster's son from Massachusetts.
Yes, I'm deliberately using examples from 65+ years ago. Because it doesn't matter what the content of those opinions are. Unless you work for the RNCC or the DNC, etc. those opinions have no value or meaning in the workplace.
I'm not afraid to express my opinions, but I choose not to do so while I'm actively on the job. That you do it out of fear is, on the one hand, unfortunate but, on the other hand, a good thing as no one really wants to hear them anyway.
Keep up the good work!
>And I never voice any political opinions at work because I don't want to say anything my peers would perceive as "abhorrent".
Good. I'm sure that, regardless of how you think your peers would perceive your opinions, they are much less interested in those opinions than they are about the quality and quantity of your work, your opinions of the work and work environment, and how you interact on a personal level with others.
Edit: Fixed typo.
The UK having a parliamentary system counteracts this due to when the coalition building step happens. In a parliamentary system, the government is formed via coalition building in the parliament after an election. However, the US being a presidential system means that post-election coalition building would be too late to impact the chief executive, the coalition must be built before the election. This combined with FPTP is what yields our two party system.
For example, imagine the US has an even 50/50 split between Democrats and Republicans. Now imagine the tension in the Democratic Party boils over and the party splits into Liberals and Progressives. Maybe some Republicans were really centrists, so they peel off to the center-left Liberal party. That might leave us with a breakdown of 45% Republicans, 35% Liberals, and 20% Progressives. This almost guarantees the president will be a Republican. Despite attracting a majority of voters, the Progressives and Liberals costs themselves a chance at winning by splitting. They would have a natural incentive to merge their parties again before the next presidential election. But if this was a parliamentary system, the Liberals and Progressives would now make up 55% of the parliament and they could successfully form a government together and choose a PM without having to actually merge parties.
The reason I blamed this entirely on FPTP in my original comment is because something like ranked choice voting is a much more reasonable change that the US could adopt. Shifting from a presidential system to a parliamentary system is an unlikely enough change that I didn't think it was worth mentioning.
People do care about murder for a lot of different reasons.
A more complete list is actually prompted at the top of that section and is https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_in_the_United_Stat....
However, you've possibly read that already since you're 41% number appears to be sourced from that page and is specifically talking about deaths and not events from 9/11/2001 to 2017. That 41% is heavily influenced by the deadliest event which was the Orlando Shooting, and if you look at the overall picture, 73% of events were perpetrated by white supremacists.
Honestly, directly reading the GAO study and the other, more recent, studies is a lot more illuminating and illustrates the growing issue of white supremacy and far-right political violence.
The facts really don't agree with you on that:
https://old.reddit.com/r/CringeTikToks/comments/1nksbmg/guy_...
Why lie? Just because you have a short memory, and cannot recall:
* A right wing extremist killed the MN speaker of the house, her spouse, and their dog
* A right wing extremist attacked Speaker Pelosi's house in an attempt to kidnap her, and attacked her husband with a hammer (an incident that republicans were happy to crack jokes about)
* January 6th, 2021
* 2022 A right wing extremist shot and killed 10 people at a supermarket in Buffalo NY.
* 2025 A right wing extremist shot up a school in Colorado
* 2018 A right wing extremist sent mail bombs to democrats
Or do you think attacks on matter if the people killed is someone you like?
And it's not like it's a surprise either. As Sartre observed[0] decades ago:
“Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.” ― Jean-Paul Sartre
It's quite nauseating.
[0] https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/7870768-never-believe-that-...
If it was just a matter of ABC cancelling Kimmel because they were afraid they'd lose ratings, or even because their new owners dislike Kimmel and his messaging, that's fine and not suppression of free speech. It's the fear of gov action against them that is problematic. Even trying to curry favor with the gov by replacing a talk show host with one more favorable to the gov, is probably still within the realm of "business decision" and not suppression of free speech -- though on the other hand, media shouldn't _need_ to curry favor with the gov because the gov is supposed to be _impartial_ to speech and only gets involved if laws/regulations are being broken. But companies trying to get on the gov's good side seems to be a (bad) feature of capitalism that I don't think we'll ever get rid of.
By the way, the self-censoring that ABC did, for fear of gov retaliation, is exactly how things work in China. The gov doesn't need to censor media companies there -- they self-censor because they know the consequences if they don't.
So basically the Trump admin is no better than communist China (though China's not actually communist, but rather just authoritarian).
https://www.mprnews.org/story/2023/07/25/poll-majority--supp...
But it's hard to make it happen when Fox paints any kind of gun measure as crazy leftist tyranny and then deep-pocketed fringe organizations like the NRA vow to punish any Republican who collaborates on compromise measures.
These were one thing, The New Deal. Done by Democrats who had 90% control of congress, a hyper popular president, and 1 out of every 5 Americans was jobless. When the Supreme Court threatened to push back on The New Deal, FDR threatened that he could pack the court, and that threat carried weight because he actually had the congress to do so, and the public would have been on his side as well. The public wanted The New Deal.
Then the Progressive Democrats got big support on the Civil Rights bill. That support was also used to force, through Federal power, a bunch of sourthern states to stop segregation and other literal racist bullshit. Many federal politicians blamed that on the Democrat party (which is untrue, both support and opposition to the Civil Rights act were bipartisan), and southern states have largely voted Republican since.
Then Carter's "Lets do clean energy and a strong environment and do the hard things to make a good nation" were so thoroughly rejected by the American public that it is considered a huge political realignment, and the Democrat party responded by giving up, and adopting neoliberal policies because they were so fucking popular with the public, that they might as well get rich and elected.
As a result, the Clinton years got us the damn Crime Bill. We also got the Nutrition Facts panel on food, and that thing is awesome in ways I think most people don't realize.
Then, when Obama came close to having real power in congress, we got the ACA.
If you want to see this nation do things, give the people who want to build things actual power. Give the Democrats actual damn power. Not "President and half of one house of congress". That's not how power works in the US system when you are following the rules.
If the Democrats got 60 senators, 400 reps, and the president, maaaybe then they could get something done, but even then, the Supreme Court could trivially stop anything they tried to do.
This is all intentional. It's how the American system was purposely designed. It's hard to build things on purpose.
This is a really bad misunderstanding of what he said. It’s clear as day, and yet you’re unable to comprehend
MAGA is trying to distance themselves from the killer, and so is the left. No one wants to be associated with that guy, and for good reason.
Not really
> it's a rather narrow, small minded world view that has to define things in those terms.
Doesn’t follow. Words have meaning, and can be applied where they make sense.
I disagree that she was bragging about it. I think she was illustrating that she can do what needs done, even the unpleasant parts. I believe it resonated well with anyone who's had to do similar tasks.
The sheep herder kills the wolf. The farmer kills the bugs that eat the crop. The rancher kills the coyote that kills his calves.
What exactly was the alternative? She should have let the dog continue to kill her chickens?
If your dog is killing your chickens, he's impacting your production.
If a goat is too old to reproduce, they're just costing money to feed and care.
Margins are thin on a farm and there's little room for such liabilities.
Thus it has been for thousands of years in agriculture.
The chickens are an investment and produce. A dog that kills chickens is a liability and it's nearly impossible to change that behavior once they get a taste for it. It will never be a good work dog.
How about sue the government just the like numerous other times they have? But that wouldn’t work in today’s world where the justice department is practically another appendage of the President himself.
UK sent stuff to USSR, too, including probably some of the stuff they got from the US, and they delivered it to Murmansk (rather than requiring the Soviets to come get it) during which their convoys and sailors took losses from the German navy.
I heard that the USSR received $1 trillion worth of stuff in 2025 dollars from it WWII allies. The US sent advisors, too, e.g., in how to build factories.
Of course, a few years later the US was sending stuff to Germany as part of the Marshall Plan, one of the purposes of which was to build up Germany so it could resist future Soviet aggression.
> December 22, 2023: "Pull him," Rogan said. "If you had any other job, and you were talking like that, they would go, 'Hey, you're done.'"
but mysteriously not when it turns out to be Trump:
> November 5, 2024: Popular podcast host Joe Rogan officially endorsed Donald Trump on the eve of the election, a move Trump’s team swiftly touted as a major win in the final hours of their campaign. (https://www.cnn.com/2024/11/04/politics/joe-rogan-trump-endo...)
People then simply unquestioningly repeated the claims, cited the same disinformation, and away we go - social media style. For instance here [2] it showed up in an Anandtech discussion, and I already linked to the claims making their way onto hacker news in dozens of posts as well. To say nothing of the cess pools that are Reddit, X, Facebook, etc.
[1] - https://xcancel.com/YourAnonCentral
[2] - https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/charlie-kirk-shot-in-th...
https://today.yougov.com/politics/articles/52988-donald-trum...
Even The Atlantic has had to admit that this is stupid and they can't work out why anyone believes it. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2025/09/charlie-ki...
> "The evidence that Robinson was a “Groyper”—a member of an online further-right-than-thou movement that had harassed Kirk and President Donald Trump—was paltry. Why did anyone believe that idea to begin with? Already it bore the marks of an incipient conspiracy theory, a soothing nugget of esoteric knowledge, suppressed for political purposes. Many of those suckered in were victims of their own motivated reasoning. It hurts to admit that a movement you like has produced a bad person, and it hurts even more to admit that bitter truth to a gloating member of a movement you hate."
They're soothing themselves. Nobody on the right is "gloating" over Kirk being killed. This really happened because leftists have deliberately tried to confuse everyone about the truth. On their safe space Bluesky they even admit to it:
https://substack.com/@mrandyngo/note/c-157561235
> "Anyway probably for the best if everyone asserts he's a Groyper whether he is or not. The narrative really does matter more than the truth in this case"
> "Lying to flood the news is good actually"
> "Spending the last week repeating that the killer was one of the right's own may have helped take the wind out of their sails. Regardless of whether that ends up being true it was rhetorically useful in the interim. Now you can pivot. Nobody is going to care what your last position was."
These tactics work. The internet has filled up with leftists who genuinely believe Kirk was killed for not being right wing enough, and anyone who tries to talk them back to reality gets answers like "I won't read any right wing sources". It's a self-created filter bubble of madness.
I hate cancel culture whether it’s coming from the conservative right (we’ve had that in Ireland for most of the 20th century) or the liberal left (more recently) and I believe that comedy should be able to transgress social norms and push up against boundaries but what I saw of Kimmel was wholly innocuous.
That's why you can blame them, because billions of private dollars should not outweigh maintaining a stable democracy and civil society for all. "Just following market incentives to maximize shareholder value" is 2025's "just following orders".
But, the anti-federalists lost the argument at the time. That doesn't mean the argument was resolved completely. It just means the federalists convinced enough people the Constitution was "good enough" for ratification. We are meant to continue improving it.
Now that we know for sure that the anti federalists were right about the necessary and proper clause and the interstate commerce clause we should be arguing for amendments. Convince enough people and it happens.
A 2017 report by The Nation Institute and the Center for Investigative
Reporting analyzed a list of the terrorist incidents which occurred in the US
between 2008 and 2016.[27] It found:[28]
115 far-right inspired terrorist incidents. 35% of these incidents were
foiled (this number means that no terrorist attacks occurred) and 29% of them
resulted in fatalities. These incidents caused 79 deaths.
63 Islamist inspired terrorist incidents. 76% of these terrorist incidents
were foiled (this number means that no terrorist attacks occurred) and 13% of
them resulted in fatalities. These incidents caused 90 deaths.
19 far-left inspired terrorist incidents. 20% of these terrorist incidents
were foiled (this number means that no terrorist attacks occurred) and 10% of
them resulted in fatalities. Two of these incidents were described as
"plausibly" attributed to a perpetrator with left-wing sympathies and caused
7 deaths. These are not included in the official government database.[15]
So out of 197 incidents reported between 2008 and 2016, 58% were "Far Right" inspired, 32% were "Islamist" inspired and 10% were "Far left" inspired.[0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_in_the_United_Stat...
AND LUIGI HELPED PEOPLE ON THE RIGHT MORE!
Engage with the facts.
The post you have is a guy with 100k subs
Destiny has nearly a million and has been incensing the situation.
https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/20/2024...
People, the government and scientists were all spreading misinformation depending on what the official messaging was at the time.
Case in point: Early on, the government was saying "Masks are not effective at stopping COVID-19" due to them wanting to control supply. When that happened, there was a large number of studies that came out showing just that. When you looked at the methodology, it was "Mask over mouth, cough into Petri dish" and see if any COVID was detectable in dish. Also "Virus particle size is much smaller than openings on mask"
When the government changed it's stance, all of those were retracted. It took the WHO 2 YEARS to change their stance and say that COVID-19 was airborne:
>In the spring of 2020, as covid-19 took hold, confusion reigned among scientists, doctors, public health experts, and others. Many insisted the spread of the new virus was through the air, yet the World Health Organization refused to use the terms “airborne” or “aerosol”1 in the context of covid-19 until 2021.2 This had repercussions as the world debated mask wearing (and what types of masks were suitable) and whether indoor spaces were a factor in infection.
>Now, four years later and after two years of deliberation by experts,3 WHO has altered its definition of the “airborne” spread of infectious pathogens in the hope of avoiding the confusion and miscommunication that characterised the first year of the pandemic—and threatened attempts to control the virus’s spread.
Dylann Roof is right wing and a racist and evil. I can say that, why can't you say the truth about Tyler.
If you tell the truth and tell your side to stop, then things will calm down.
Yet, you're insulting those who can read the words on a page.
Why?
I added an edit after re-reading the comments.
If you cannot comprehend the shades of grey in the world, maybe you need more exposure to it.
It was bragging because it's meant to be a story about how she's capable of doing the "hard" things, which is the perspective that reality is tough, and you need to be willing to hurt some people to do "the right" thing.
It's literally Call of Duty's philosophy, that only the "hardest" people, who can do literally cruel and awful things, like illegal torture, because they must be done, and those bleeding heart liberals can't kill a dog if it's the "right" thing.
I guess my point is: these people are all interconnected and it’s almost like when you hear about how actors all know each other and hang out, or congresspeople play golf together, but for fascism.
I agree it could have been worded better but I think it’s clear if you watch it in context.
You second link is 404 and I have no idea what you're talking about. The subject is what used to be the United States. A concept that no longer exists because we're too shitty.
> Halloween photos showing Robinson riding on the back of an inflatable Donald Trump or dressed as a gopnik offshoot of Pepe the frog, the now-anachronistic alt-right meme that evolved into the groyper mascot.
> Groypers had hassled Kirk at public appearances over the years for what they saw as his insufficiently radical conservatism. (Fuentes has forcefully denied any connection to the shooting and told his followers he would “disavow” and “disown” any who “take up arms.”)
> But as the internet quickly pointed out, “Bella Ciao” is both an anti-fascist anthem from post-WWII Italy and a remixed track on a groyper Spotify playlist.
This would be misinformation if it would turn out to be false, but it would not be misinformation based on whether or not the shooter is leaning this way or that way or no way.
Where? The rest of your post as connection to this topic hinges on this claim, yet it isn't supported.
If you can fit in the Aliens show before your billing date it's worth watching if you are a normal person that can allow yourself to enjoy TV shows.
Thanks for your feedback and previous discussion.
----
I know I'm crazy (the fun side) but can be serious when trying to share commonalities / discriminations (against murderers — lol — I get your initial point/comment).
Have a great day.
Given identical circumstances, I would hesitate even less doing this again.
He also inscribed a bullet with "If you read this, you are gay lmao."
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/09/13/us/politics/tyler-robinso...
Umm, not necessarily. Apparently, the engravings are used by right wing trolls[0][1][2], many of them who absolutely despised Charlie Kirk.
As such, let's not jump to any conclusions unless and until we have factual information.
[0] https://knowyourmeme.com/editorials/guides/what-is-a-groyper...
[1] https://mastodon.world/@jeffowski/115199287909601561
[2] https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/639/464/1e4
If you have sufficient evidence to make reasonable conclusion, which is negated by newer evidence. It is not misinformation.
Misinformation would be if you know something is not true and you twist facts around and present speculation in a factual manner to imply that it is true.
The specific (ridiculous) claim is that this person was well adjusted prior to college, then attended college, and through his one semester at college became not just a leftist but a leftist who was willing to murder for his ideology.
The right is killing people, right now. You pretending that it's a right/left thing, when it clearly isn't, speaks to your ... intent.
Also, the page only has pretty good resources up until like 2020, where it ends with a study from the Center for Strategic and International Studies which reviews data up to May 2020, and DHS which reviews data from 2018-2019. The CSIS one is pretty good because it includes graphs of data over time and really shows the worrying increase across the board but the staggering increase of "right-wing" violence since the mid 2010s.
CSIS has a few more studies more recently it looks like. There's https://www.csis.org/analysis/pushed-extremes-domestic-terro... from 2022, which shows that 49% of events were committed by far-right and 40% were far-left. However, the far-right were more likely to target people with guns and bombs and the far-left were more likely to target property with melee and incendiary weapons, so 28 of the 30 deaths were from the far-right while the far-left accounted for 1.
Then a few more years later, there's https://www.csis.org/analysis/rising-threat-anti-government-.... Which is more about the increase in "partisan political belief" based attacks, and then gives some examples instead of breaking it down further.
However, CSIS likewise uses their own database of attacks, and in between the other studies and the most recent one it appears they changed their methodology of what attacks were included to make it more strictly about an attempt or threat to kill (which would remove a lot of the property based attacks from the previous study), premeditation, and desire to strike fear broadly. I'd be interested in seeing a revisitation of their previous methods with their new datasets, or even to actually be able to see the dataset itself.
> We hit some new lows over the weekend with the MAGA gang desperately trying to characterize this kid who murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them, and doing everything they can to score political points from it
"My side" is Americans who think political violence is disgusting.
What 'side' are you on?
When you live in a rural area, nobody wants a chicken-killing dog cause most them have chickens - and those that don't - have neighbors that have chickens and you don't want to be that neighbor.
If there are reasonable alternatives, please do avail yourself. When there are none, putting an animal down is best and is common practice.
and really the moose are a lot more likely than bears to go after you.
more qualifiers as well such as with calf or cubs, hunting and predation engagement being interrupted ect.
The source for the killer being a groyper is solely the disinformation account. The things you've mentioned are postfacto efforts to try to support the disinformation, in rather nonsensical ways I'd add. A Spotify playlist from some random guy, to try to create some 5d chess argument - also known as mental gymnastics, and Robinson riding around on a demeaned looking Trump doll 8 years ago? [1] If that's the best people can dig up, you should realize you're obviously being lied to.
[1] - https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15092455/Trump-cost...
Which is repeating the lie that Robinson is right wing. 100% false. He deserved to be fired for saying this, because it is delusional misinformation.
No, the source is the string of corroborating incidents.
Sure, the two examples you bring up could be innocuous by themselves, but together with a "gopnik offshoot of Pepe the frog", his upbringing, and the fact that there are clearly fractures within the otherwise very top-down right-wing movement?
You're very adamant to dismiss any pieces of evidence as inconsequential (not as incorrect, mind you), yet resistant to provide any counter-factuals?
What he said is a critique on the "MAGA Gang"'s handling of the murder, in that they are less concerned with doing anything productive and more concerned with "scoring political points".
Whether or not "this kid" is one of them or not is inconsequential to the statement, and that sentence does not claim so.
Nobody would, in a million years, reasonably think 'Ah hah - this must mean he's actually a groyper.' Stuff like this is exactly why Trump won the popular vote, something no Republican had done in 20 years. There is an increasingly rampant level of mental illness in the liberal camp regularly paired alongside outright denials of reality, and child-like efforts to gaslight.
A few more assassinations other degrees of political stupidity and we'll be well on our way to a one-party country. And I say this as somebody who has never once voted Republican, and until recently I would have readily identified as liberal. But now? It's starting to feel like a tainted term. My views haven't changed, but the distribution of views amongst self described liberals have, and I do not want to be associated with this madness.
The previous administration was doing the same thing; Publicly saying that they wanted to change laws, that these companies were killing people etc. At the same time, they were also asking the companies to remove people for their speech. The threat was implicit.
I don't like that the current republican administration is doing it now, I didn't like it when the previous democrat administration was doing it then.
The only way to keep it from happening is for everyone to speak up, for that to happen you also need to recognize when your team is doing the same thing and call them out. Look at the comments saying "I bet we won't hear from the freeze peach crowd", of course you won't see them. Not because they don't care however but because their disagreement of the government action is getting lost in the noise of your crowds.
I see. You're trying to pretend that intentionally subverting public health measures should be free speech and that the Biden administration did something like what the authoritarians are doing now. I disagree, though I'm not super familiar with the government intervention or lack of during covid. I have no desire to discuss it as it has no relevance to this context.
You're lying by creating a false equivalence and don't deserve replies.
The Supreme Court has been walking that back ever since(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandenburg_v._Ohio).
>There is no clearly established public health exception among the 43 judicially recognized exceptions to the First Amendment. https://www.thefire.org/news/blogs/ronald-kl-collins-first-a...
Please don't accuse me of lying, it's rude. Especially if you are also saying you are not familiar with what happened at that time.
It is a shame that you are unable to look at a situation where high level officials from one administration were asking why someone was allowed to express their views and that the administration was looking into how to hold them accountable and see how it is the mirror.
"Facebook needs to move more quickly to remove harmful, violative posts" - White House press secretary Jen Psaki
"Shouldn't they(Facebook and Twitter) be liable for publishing that information and then open to lawsuits?" - MSNBC "Certainly, they should be held accountable, You've heard the president speak very aggressively about this. He understands this is an important piece of the ecosystem." - White House Communications Director Kate Bedingfield
“We can do this the easy way or the hard way, These companies can find ways to change conduct and take actions on Kimmel, or there’s going to be additional work for the FCC ahead.” - FCC Chair Brendan Carr