Heritable != Molecular / Genetic Mechanism
There is a conflation of these terms in popular discourse that does a disservice to the field of statistical genetics, imo. There are mechanisms of inheritance that operate various length / time scales other than that of biological macromolecules. For example, if you tell me what language your parents natively speak I can tell you your primary language with >90% accuracy.
So before we start getting 3 replies deep into any thead, please remember that retrospective observational data measured with unqualified instruments is notoriously confounded and that we can barely infer causal structure in controlled functional genomics experiments (much less a GWAS of phewas). So let’s all please keep an open mind and not be so certain about our beliefs.
> Almost all human traits are partly genetic and partly due to the environment and/or random. If you could change the world and reduce the amount of randomness, then of course heritability would go up.
There has been a lot of effort to determine systematic environmental factors that would influence things like intelligence and while it's easy to do harm (lead exposure) it's all but impossible to do any good.It implies that the only environment that matters is either purely random (truly random accidents, circumstances) or non-systematic (results from non-linear interaction of environment and genes).
When stated that way it almost feels like a tautology because this is what genes exist to do in the first place. To control the interactions of their vessel and environment to the maximum degree. And from the perspective of an individual gene, all the other genes are part of the environment too.
> There is no such thing as “true” heritability, independent of the contingent facts of our world.
It's uncomputable (need to run Monte Carlo simulations on a human life). All efforts are to approximate it.Which I bet is very useful for some kind of technical work, but it's amusingly confusing to lay people.
The author goes on to critique its misuses but the textbook example to make clear "heritability" is not as obvious as it sounds is that by this definition human bipedalism heritability is near zero because there's near zero variance.
> Heritability of human lifespan is about 50% when extrinsic mortality is adjusted to be closer to modern levels.
I think by “accounting for confounding factors” they mean setting extrinsic mortality to the equivalent of zero contribution. So you’d expect it to be the asymptote left side.
0: especially enjoyed talking about typos and then writing “doing to go”. I like little jokes like that.
Why is it applied to twins if genes are inherited from parent to child?
How readhedness is 100%? I understand Mendel study in school is simplification, but you can get all sorts of gene mixes in kids
Hmm let me just check Wiktionary for "heritable"
> Genetically transmissible from parent to offspring
Ok then. Maybe it has some specific meaning in biology? A search for "heritable meaning in biology" let me to this page: https://www.cancer.gov/publications/dictionaries/cancer-term...
> In medicine, describes a characteristic or trait that can be passed from a parent to a child through the genes.
IMO this post is dumb and the paper is perfectly clear to non-pedants.
And so in modern times if it turns out that eating less than most people apparently want to contributes to IQ, are you doing something good by eating less, or are they doing something bad by eating more? I think it's basically the same thing, just looked at in different ways.
That's just a meaningless statement no different from "while it's easy to subtract negative numbers, it's all but impossible to add positive numbers."
> or non-systematic (results from non-linear interaction of environment and genes).
Non-linear interaction does not mean non-systematic. Computer programs are fully deterministic (and therefore "systematic") while being non-linear (and therefore generally unpredictable). It is true to say that when things are non-linear it's hard to tell with certainty what effect some policy will have, but given that most human systems are non-linear, this is true for just about everything.
My intuition is that the average genetic human potential, for traits that are ostensibly hierarchical, is higher and narrower than is usually accepted - which is uncomfortable for those whose ambitions require, either directly or by incidence, that most people don't reach that potential. Or, that they're not actually hierarchical traits at all; value depends on context (and is generally made up).
Oddly, the former is probably preferable to most, since, "There is no inherent value in dying old versus young," probably doesn't track for most people.
Seems like the author is doing some redefining here like he's accusing the paper's author.
Perhaps the statement was meant to mean "fulfillment of hereditary characteristics change when society changes" but it wouldn't be that hard to say it if that's what it was supposed to be...
It seems incredibly disingenuous to lump together epigentics and hair dye when talking about heritability of hair color. We all know when we talk about inheriting hair color we're talking about natural hair color.
> his paper built a mathematical model that tries to simulate how long people would live in a hypothetical world in which no one dies from any non-aging related cause, meaning no car accidents, no drug overdoses, no suicides, no murders, and no (non-age-related) infectious disease.
Which is exactly what everyone means by lifespan in this context. No one on earth is trying to figure out how much genetics contributes to the odds of being hit by a bus.
> veryone seems to be interpreting this paper as follows:
>> Aha! We thought the heritability of lifespan was 23-35%. But it turns out that it’s around 50%. Now we know!
Which is the correct interpretation. Proper elimination of confounding factors is good science. The previous estimates were low because they weren't properly measuring what we are all referring to when we talk about lifespan.
Some ways of measuring heritability would have trouble detecting this as environmental, but that is considered a deficiency in those measures, not part of the definition of heritability. Any serious study into heritability of language would quickly find it is largely due to the common environment.
You don't find better nutrition and sexual selection for height satisfactory?
> value depends on context (and is generally made up).
Value is not relative. It is objective, ontological, and teleological. Context only shifts situational value relevance, but the value itself remains as is.
This comment might be very useful in a Reddit thread full of people saying "50% of lifespan is in your DNA," but it's a bit off-target as a response to this particular article.
Identical twins have the same DNA. Any differences between the 2 of them is not genetic. Studies of twins are very important when you try to separate "nature vs nurture".
Then there's the matter of whether there's just a small population with the genes for it, and whether it's polygenic, or mitochondrial, or otherwise non-mendelian, and all that gets factored into this heritability value along with cultural things like the use of concealer and the probability of having your face torn off by a bear. It kind of reminds me of inflation, as a useful measure.
Perhaps suggestive, but far from conclusive (I know you know this too). To me, it is suggestive that there is likely some other factor that may explain the relationship better, but then again, I am wrong more often than right, so what do I know? ;)
For example, compare that to growing wealth inequality, and I wouldn't be surprised if that is a potential factor. Less income = less access to care, less access to healthier food options, perhaps less time to for self-care, etc., and if wealth/career potential is gatekept by academic achievement, economic utility, or intelligence, then I can see the two, intelligence and BMI, being correlated, but not directly causal. Though, no study would give people large sums of money to improve their lives, so I doubt we will know for certain.
Classical writers speak of this as well, things like how inordinate and undisciplined appetites (not just for food, mind you; sex, too, and undue acquisitiveness of all sorts, for instance) darken the mind. What is inordinate and undisciplined is not proportioned or directed by reason. So, such character traits are rooted in fidelity to reason which means that not only do they avoid the aforementioned darkening of the mind by moderation of appetite, but the very character strength of being able to do so enables rational existence in other things.
Innate intelligence doesn't secure discipline. Indeed, it gives the person a bigger footgun and allows for more elaborate rationalizations of vice.
Two corrollaries:
* When discussing heritability results from the literature, we are discussing that statistic, not your intuitive understanding of what the word should mean.
* In the scientific literature, your conception of heritability doesn't operate. In the scientific sense, the number of hands you have has low heritability, despite being genetically determined.
I think you're going to find "let's check Wiktionary" is not the decisive move in these kinds of discussions that it is elsewhere.
I'd personally count nutrition squarely in the second category
That said, there are plenty of critiques of this definition of heritability, and not just because it is different from what a layperson would expect it to mean.
For example, the way it is used also usually has a big problem in that the standard formula assumes that Cov(G, E) = 0 (or at least is negligible), whereas in practice that is not actually true [3, 4].
This definition of heritability is also mathematically flawed in that it assumes (without evidence) that P = G + E, or at least can be reasonably approximated this way. Given that human development is the result of a feedback loop involving genetic and environmental factors, one would expect a model closer to something like a Markov chain. Proposed justifications of a simple additive model as an approximation (e.g. via the central limit theorem for highly polygenic traits) have to my knowledge never been tested.
More recent genome-wide association studies [5] have actually shown a considerable gap between heritability estimates from genotype data and heritability estimates from twin studies, known as the "missing heritability problem".
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heritability
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_variance
[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene%E2%80%93environment_inter...
[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene%E2%80%93environment_corre...
[5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genome-wide_association_study
in 20th century most of the world moved past famine and toxins - did any factor of similar scale happen in 21st century as well to start looking for opposite processes?
And you wouldn't draw a distinction between the person who is short because of poor diet and the person who is short because they lost their legs in a car accident? Both are "environmental factors" which affect the distance between the top of your head and the ground, but that's not what we are referring to by height.
> we've always talking about confounded measures.
No, we haven't. It doesn't matter that confounding factors exist in the data, we can and near exclusively do talk about abstract concepts. We live in a world where there are no perfect circles, but we can talk about things having diameters. We live in a world where people die from unnatural causes, but we can still talk about people having natural lifespans. That removing confounding factors is hard doesn't change the fact we routinely make our best effort to do just that because it is necessary for discussing the abstract concept we all refer to.
A few centuries aren't long enough for such marked selective pressure on a polygenic trait.
>Value is not relative. It is objective, ontological, and teleological.
I am conflating objective measurements (value) with subjective situational qualifications of the relevance of those measurements (also "value", kinda) because most people understand that I mean the latter. I acknowledge your pedantic correction of this conflation; please feel good about yourself and move on with your day.
Regardless of what underlying trait it's actually measuring, the habituation factory is a big component of its supposed bias - that is, has your background taught you the kind of problem-solving habits that will help you to post the best possible score?
Here's the producer of the hydrogels talking about the exact process of getting the maximum carbohydrates into the runner:
https://maurten.no/blogs/m-magazine/how-sabastian-sawe-fuele...
> At the elite level, marathon performance is defined by energy availability as much as physiology.
> Maintaining a pace of 2:50 per kilometer requires a constant supply of fuel. Even small disruptions in energy delivery can result in significant time loss.
For instance, OP's definition H = Var[G] / Var[P] seems to bypass the issues you mentioned:
> For example, the way it is used also usually has a big problem in that the standard formula assumes that Cov(G, E) = 0 (or at least is negligible), whereas in practice that is not actually true [3, 4].
> This definition of heritability is also mathematically flawed in that it assumes (without evidence) that P = G + E, or at least can be reasonably approximated this way.
Literally the first paragraph of that page is
> Heritability is a statistic used in the fields of breeding and genetics that estimates the degree of variation in a phenotypic trait in a population that is due to genetic variation between individuals in that population. The concept of heritability can be expressed in the form of the following question: "What is the proportion of the variation in a given trait within a population that is not explained by the environment or random chance?"
That matches what I assumed it meant, and it seems like OP and the post are arguing that that is some kind of surprising interpretation.
> OK, but check this out: Say I redefine “hair color” to mean “hair color except ignoring epigenetic and embryonic stuff and pretending that no one ever goes gray or dyes their hair et cetera”. Now, hair color is 100% heritable. Amazing, right?
Uhm, no. That is exactly what I (and I think most people) would expect the answer to be.
Are you sure? In extremis, if blue-eyed people (a polygenic trait) are considered absolutely unfuckable, I would expect them to disappear from the population in 10-15 generations, or at least become very, very rare.
The unintuitive part is that in quantitative genetics, heritability is defined in terms of variance in traits at the population level, not as the passing of traits from parents to offspring (that would be heredity [1]). Of course, I may have misinterpreted what you said in your OP when you cited the wiktionary definition of "[g]enetically transmissible from parent to offspring", and if so, I apologize, but at the time it seemed to me that you were talking about heredity.
> Uhm, no. That is exactly what I (and I think most people) would expect the answer to be.
What the article is talking about is that if you fix Var(E) = 0, then Var(P) = Var(G) in the standard heritability model, i.e. all phenotypic variance is explained entirely by genotypic variance (because in that model, Var(P) = Var(G) + Var(E)).
Fun fact (even if only tangentially unrelated): In Western countries, wearing glasses is a highly heritable trait, because wearing glasses is a strong proxy variable for refractive error [2], such as nearsightedness, which is highly heritable. It is often brought up as another example of how the quantitative genetics definition does not match conventional use of the word.
How heritable is hair color? Well, if you’re a redhead and you have an identical twin, they will definitely also be a redhead. But the age at which twins go gray seems to vary a bit based on lifestyle. And there’s some randomness in where melanocytes end up on your skull when you’re an embryo. And your twin might dye their hair! So the correct answer is, some large number, but less than 100%.
OK, but check this out: Say I redefine “hair color” to mean “hair color except ignoring epigenetic and embryonic stuff and pretending that no one ever goes gray or dyes their hair et cetera”. Now, hair color is 100% heritable. Amazing, right?
Or—how heritable is IQ? The wise man answers, “Some number between 0% or 100%, it’s not that important, please don’t yell at me.” But whatever the number is, it depends on society. In our branch of the multiverse, some kids get private tutors and organic food and $20,000 summer camps, while other kids get dysfunctional schools and lead paint and summers spent drinking Pepsi and staring at glowing rectangles. These things surely have at least some impact on IQ.
But again, watch this: Say I redefine “IQ” to be “IQ in some hypothetical world where every kid got exactly the same school, nutrition, and parenting, so none of those non-genetic factors matter anymore.” Suddenly, the heritability of IQ is higher. Thrilling, right? So much science.
If you want to redefine stuff like this… that’s not wrong. I mean, heritability is a pretty arbitrary concept to start with. So if you prefer to talk about heritability in some other world instead of our actual world, who am I to judge?
Incidentally, here’s a recent paper:

I STRESS THAT THIS IS A PERFECTLY FINE PAPER. I’m picking on it mostly because it was published in Science, meaning—like all Science papers—it makes grand claims but is woefully vague about what those claims mean or what was actually done. Also, publishing in Science is morally wrong and/or makes me envious. So I thought I’d try to explain what’s happening.
It’s actually pretty simple. At least, now that I’ve spent several hours reading the paper and its appendix over and over again, I’ve now convinced myself that it’s pretty simple. So, as a little pedagogical experiment, I’m going to try to explain the paper three times, with varying levels of detail.
The normal way to estimate the heritability of lifespan is using twin data. Depending on what dataset you use, this will give 23-35%. This paper built a mathematical model that tries to simulate how long people would live in a hypothetical world in which no one dies from any non-aging related cause, meaning no car accidents, no drug overdoses, no suicides, no murders, and no (non-age-related) infectious disease. On that simulated data, for simulated people in a hypothetical world, heritability was 46-57%.
Everyone seems to be interpreting this paper as follows:
Aha! We thought the heritability of lifespan was 23-35%. But it turns out that it’s around 50%. Now we know!
I understand this. Clearly, when the editors at Science chose the title for this paper, their goal was to lead you to that conclusion. But this is not what the paper says. What it says is this:
We built a mathematical model of alternate universe in which nobody died from accidents, murder, drug overdoses, or infectious disease. In that model, heritability was about 50%.
Let’s start over. Here’s figure 2 from the paper.

Normally, heritability is estimated from twin studies. The idea is that identical twins share 100% of their DNA, while fraternal twins share only 50%. So if some trait is more correlated among identical twins than among fraternal twins, that suggests DNA influences that trait. There are statistics that formalize this intuition. Given a dataset that records how long various identical and fraternal twins lived, these produce a heritability number.
Two such traditional estimates appear as black circles in the above figures. For the Danish twin cohort, lifespan is estimated to be 23% heritable. For the Swedish cohort, it’s 35%.
This paper makes a “twin simulator”. Given historical data, they fit a mathematical model to simulate the lifespans of “new” twins. Then they compute heritability on this simulated data.
Why calculate heritability on simulated data instead of real data? Well, their mathematical model contains an “extrinsic mortality” parameter, which is supposed to reflect the chance of death due to all non-aging-related factors like accidents, murder, or infectious disease. They assume that the chance someone dies from any of this stuff is constant over people, constant over time, and that it accounts for almost all deaths for people aged between 15 and 40.
The point of building the simulator is that it’s possible to change extrinsic mortality. That’s what’s happening in the purple curves in the above figure. For a range of different extrinsic mortality parameters, they simulate datasets of twins. For each simulated dataset, they estimate heritability just like with a real dataset.
Note that the purple curves above nearly hit the black circles. This means that if they run their simulator with extrinsic mortality set to match reality, they get heritability numbers that line up with what we get from real data. That suggests their mathematical model isn’t totally insane.
If you decrease extrinsic mortality, then you decrease the non-genetic randomness in how long people live. So heritability goes up. Hence, the purple curves go up as you go to the left.
My explanation of this paper relies on some amount of guesswork. For whatever reason, Science has decided that papers should contain almost no math, even when the paper in question is about math. So I’m mostly working from an English description. But even that description isn’t systematic. There’s no place that clearly lays out all the things they did, in order. Instead, you get little hints, sort of randomly distributed throughout the paper. There’s an appendix, which the paper confidently cites over and over. But if you actually read the appendix, it’s just more disconnected explanations of random things except now with equations set in glorious Microsoft Word format.
Now, in most journals, authors write everything. But Science has professional editors. Given that every single statistics-focused paper in Science seems to be like this, we probably shouldn’t blame the authors of this one. (Other than for their decision to publish in Science in the first place.)
I do wonder what those editors are doing, though. I mean, let me show you something. Here’s the first paragraph where they start to actually explain what they actually did, from the first page:

See that h(t,θ) at the end? What the hell is that, you ask? That’s a good question, because it was never introduced before this and is never mentioned again. I guess it’s just supposed to be f(t,θ), which is fine. (I yield to none in my production of typos.) But if paying journals ungodly amounts of money brought us to this, of what use are those journals?
Moving on…
Probably most people don’t need this much detail and should skip this section. For everyone else, let’s start over one last time.
The “normal” way to estimate heritability is by looking at correlations between different kinds of twins. Intuitively, if the lifespans of identical twins are more correlated than the lifespans of fraternal twins, that suggests lifespan is heritable. And it turns out that one estimator for heritability is “twice the difference between the correlation among identical twins and the correlation among fraternal twins, all raised together.” There are other similar estimators for other kinds of twins. These normally say lifespan is perhaps 20% and 35% heritable.
This paper created an equation to model the probability a given person will die at a given age. The parameters of the equation vary from person to person, reflecting that some of us have DNA that predisposes us to live longer than others. But the idea is that the chances of dying are fairly constant between the ages of 15 and 40, after which they start increasing.
This equation contains an “extrinsic mortality” parameter. This is meant to reflect the chance of death due to all non-aging related factors like accidents or murder, etc. They assume this is constant. (Constant with respect to people and constant over time.) Note that they don’t actually look at any data on causes of death. They just add a constant risk of death that’s shared by all people at all ages to the equation, and then they call this “extrinsic mortality”.
Now remember, different people are supposed to have different parameters in their probability-of-death equations. To reflect this, they fit a Gaussian distribution (bell curve) to the parameters with the goal of making it fit with historical data. The idea is that if the distribution over parameters were too broad, you might get lots of people dying at 15 or living until 120, which would be wrong. If the distribution were too concentrated, then you might get everyone dying at 43, which would also be wrong. So they find a good distribution, one that makes the ages people die in simulation look like the ages people actually died in historical data.
Right! So now they have:
Before moving on, I remind you of two things:
The event of a person dying at a given age is random. But the probability that this happens is assumed to be fixed and determined by genes and genes alone.
Now they simulate different kinds of twins. To simulate identical twins, they just draw parameters from their parameter distribution, assign those parameters to two different people, and then let them randomly die according to their death equation. (Is this getting morbid?) To simulate fraternal twins, they do the same thing, except instead of giving the two twins identical parameters, they give them correlated parameters, to reflect that they share 50% of their DNA.
How exactly do they create those correlated parameters? They don’t explain this in the paper, and they’re quite vague in the supplement. As far as I can tell they sample two sets of parameters from their parameter distribution such that the parameters are correlated at a level of 0.5.
Now they have simulated twins. They can simulate them with different extrinsic mortality values. If they lower extrinsic mortality, heritability of lifespan goes up. If they lower it to zero, heritability goes up to around 50%.
Almost all human traits are partly genetic and partly due to the environment and/or random. If you could change the world and reduce the amount of randomness, then of course heritability would go up. That’s true for life expectancy just life for anything else. So what’s the point of this paper?
There is a point!
Sure, obviously heritability would be higher in a world without accidents or murder. We don’t need a paper to know that. But how much higher? It’s impossible to say without modeling and simulating that other world.
Our twin datasets are really old. It’s likely that non-aging-related deaths are lower now in the past, because we have better healthcare and so on. This means that the heritability of lifespan for people alive today may be larger than it was for the people in our twin datasets, some of whom were born in 1870. We won’t know for sure until we’re all dead, but this paper gives us a way to guess.
Have I mentioned that heritability depends on society? And that heritability changes when society changes? And that heritability is just a ratio and you should stop trying to make it be a non-ratio because only-ratio things cannot be non-ratios? This is a nice reminder.
Honestly, I think the model the paper built is quite clever. Nothing is perfect, but I think this is a pretty good run at the question of, “How high would the heritability of lifespan be if extrinsic mortality were lower?”
I only have two objections. The first is to the Science writing style. This is a paper describing a statistical model. So shouldn’t there be somewhere in the paper where they explain exactly what they did, in order, from start to finish? Ostensibly, I think this is done in the left-hand column on the second page, just with little detail because Science is written for a general audience. But personally I think that description is the worst of all worlds. Instead of giving the high-level story in a coherent way, it throws random technical details at you without enough information to actually make sense of them. Couldn’t the full story with the full details at least be in the appendix? I feel like this wasted hours of my time, and that if someone wanted to reproduce this work, they would have almost no chance of doing so from the description given. How have we as a society decided that we should take our “best” papers and do this to them?
But my main objection is this:

At first, I thought this was absurd. The fact that people die in car accidents is not a “confounding factor”. And pretending that no one dies in a car accidents does not “address” some kind of bias. That’s just computing heritability in some other world. Remember, heritability is not some kind of Platonic form. It is an observational statistic. There is no such thing as “true” heritability, independent of the contingent facts of our world.
But upon reflection, I think they’re trying to say something like this:
Heritability of human lifespan is about 50% when extrinsic mortality is adjusted to be closer to modern levels.
The problem is: I think this is… not true? Here are the actual heritability estimates in the paper, varying by dataset (different plots) the cutoff year (colors) and extrinsic mortality (x-axis).

When extrinsic mortality goes down, heritability goes up. So the obvious question is: What is extrinsic mortality in modern people?
This is a tricky question, because “extrinsic mortality” isn’t some simple observational statistic. It is a parameter in their model. (Remember, they never looked at causes of death.) So it’s hard to say, but they seem to suggest that extrinsic mortality in modern people is 0.001 / year, or perhaps a bit less.
The above figures have the base-10 logarithm of extrinsic mortality on the x-axis. And the base-10 logarithm of 0.001 is -3. But if you look at the curves when the x-axis is -3, the heritability estimates are not 50%. They’re more like 35-45%, depending on the particular model and age cutoff.
So here’s my suggested title:
Heritability of human lifespan is about 40% when extrinsic mortality is adjusted to modern levels, according to our simulation.
There might be a reason I don’t work at Science.